AIG and our insurance

Insurance and various paperwork needed for our planes
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AIG and our insurance

Post by joea » Tue Mar 17, 2009 23:24

Just wanted to get others ideas on the AIG situation. Since WE now own the company and THEY just gave their top brass $160 million in bonus payments, I would expect that OUR insurance premiums (as we, the taxpayers, are now the owners of the company) will go down in price, right? Ok, I am dreaming...

Anyway I received a call from the insurance agent on the airplane that I fly for a living asking me how I felt about the current situation. Seems that his phone has been ringing off of the hook with owners telling him to find insurance elsewhere as they do not want to support AIG after this latest screw-up.

I have just sent an email to my Aeronca insurance agent asking them to look elsewhere for insurance coverage when my policy is due in several months. I am very happy with my current insurance agent, but my coverage is with AIG and I am NOT happy with them.

What are everyone's thoughts on this? I sure do not want to support AIG after they act like this.

Joe A

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Post by Nathan K. Hammond » Wed Mar 18, 2009 00:37

Couple things that are aggravating about the situation to me;

AIG is now owned by the government; for THIS reason, I will not support them, or buy their coverage.

If AIG wants to give 70+/- people a bonus of $1million or more, that's fine with me, thats capitalism. Let those dumbass exec's run the company into the ground... again.

But what really sends me over the edge is the government stepping in for AIG, and in the span of 2 weeks, giving my money to them, knowing full well what will happen. And now Geithner and Obamy are trying to play dumb so the heat is off their idea of throwing MORE money out the window.

Obama and his policies are like a good fart; loud, obnoxious and make you feel good, right up to the point you realize you shit your pants. :?

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Post by Carl Prather » Wed Mar 18, 2009 08:19

Not that anyone likes it, but the bonuses apparently are contractual guarantees so the money is more like regular income. If only we regular folks could be so lucky. Remember, we are being reminded by those in the business that talent is a scarce commodity demanding appropriate compensation. This money is called employee retention payments.

The government knew about these bonuses before Obama was sworn in and the bailout money, oops, I mean that restructuring money was approved by the last administration and voted in by both parties. One of the reasons attention is being paid now is that the payments for some of the bonuses are coming due.

The AIG financial Products Unit in the UK, a group of only 357 people, is the center of much of these toxic assets and infamous credit default swaps and where much of the bonuses were provided. This unit was the darling of AIG and was touted at one time as the business model of the future.

I'm not so sure I could sleep at night taking the money while ruining the lives of so many. My guess is that fat bank balances a make a good substitute for a conscience. Sleep well, my rich friends.

Still, we own 80% of the company. It's time for AIG to make an honest day's pay for an honest day's work and for that I will hold the current administration responsible. I do not wish poorly on the company as a whole because the vast majority of the employees are no different than any one of us but I do detest the elitism and the grand sense of entitlement by those at the top and they should be fired scarce commodities or not.

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Post by MikeB » Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:01

As I previously posted, my insurance was renewed a couple of weeks ago with AIG (before the latest shoe dropped) so I will probably stay with them for the time being. That being said, I'm very unhappy with the managment structure of the corporation. We now own 80% of the company. Being somewhat of a 'red neck' :roll: from a very liberal state (Wisconsin) I'd be inclined to let the company fail. Known as 'you rolled the dice, now you pay the price'. But what do I know about high finance? I'm just a guy (like probably most of you) who worked all his life, paid his bills, paid my home off and managed to get two kids through college on a teacher's salary. My starting pay in 1967 was $5832 per year which was about $1200 less than I was making as a shop foreman at the time.

Personally, there's plenty of blame to go around with both the past and present administration. However, I tend to blame both Chris Dodd and Barney Frank who were in charge of the banking and finance committees and 'steered' legislation. Let's face it. There are some people who simply can't afford to own a home for whatever reason. Someone told me once that if you gave a mixed group of people each $1000, in six months some would double or triple their money and others would be broke because they blew it (probably at the casino or lottery tickets). I have no problem helping those who need help but common sense has to prevail and people need to take responsibility.

Off my soap box and back to painting on the L16 :D :D :D .

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Post by jc pacquin » Thu Mar 19, 2009 15:16

AIG delt in credit default swaps. They underwrote policys and used this terminology as if they had used Credit Default INSURANCE, (which it what it is,) they would have had to be......REGULATED! It was by far their London Office that did most of the damage. The man in charge, now gone, left with big money. They were dishonest. The current administration had NOTHING to do with it. The former had ALOT to do with it and could have REGULATED these criminals using the public media and DEMANDING that the corrupt CONGRESS at that time DO SOMETHING! DEREGULATION caused the current problems both in banking and in the stock market. I think both Democrats AND Republicans are guilt but it started, ONCE AGAIN, it STARTED with Ronnie Reagan who deregulated most everything he could get his hands on. It was a TRAGIC mistake. He defunded every regulatory agency causing them to be inefficient, then said, "See, Government doesn't work!" Too many LAWYERS and LOBBYISTS! Get Rid of em! Term Limits! Your thoughts? JP

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Post by Dennis » Thu Mar 19, 2009 18:59

Nathan,

Your stock just went up a bunch in my opinion. I think you hit the nail on the head with your statement:

Dennis

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Post by jkvincent » Sat Mar 21, 2009 19:28

...it's square on the backs of DEMOCRATS, A-Holes Barney Frank and Chris Dodd's arm twisting of these corporations to make loans
to people who obviously couldn't pay it back is the problem.
It's not over, they will get more.
I could rant on for hours, but it would be a waste of time.
Don't blame me, I didn't vote for any of them.
Last edited by jkvincent on Sun Mar 22, 2009 20:14, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Nathan K. Hammond » Sun Mar 22, 2009 12:21

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Post by Jerry Eichenberger » Wed Mar 25, 2009 09:25

I think the original question dealt with AIG. To me, and I do know something about it, they offer some of the best claims service in the industry; but then, most aviation insurance companies are top notch in claims service, which is why we buy insurance in the first place.

Whatever the London based rogues did should not impact whether you buy aviation insurance from AIG - their underlying insurace operations are very sound, and their aviation people are first class.

And, the gov't will only own the shares until the loans are re-paid, some of which already have been.
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Post by joea » Wed Mar 25, 2009 09:44

Jerry,

Its not the "London based rogues" who concern me, its the head of the company here in America. First "they simply do not get it" is the expression I hear the most, and second most companies in this situation would have woken up six months ago.

Sorry but I hope to not support a company who acts like this. Even if it costs me a bit more would rather take my business to a company who acts a bit more reasonable.

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Post by Jerry Eichenberger » Wed Mar 25, 2009 09:56

Joe -

The new AIG chairman, Liddy, took over just a few months ago, long after the transactions and events that caused the problems.
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Post by joea » Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:57

Jerry,

Thanks but most of us who do not live in a cave realized this after seeing him on the television about 18 hours a day in the investigations.

He is not the main reason for our heartburn, but the way he acted did not help. Neither does the main guys at AIG returning some of their bonus money.

Its simply the whole attitude and way that they did and are acting. I choose to support someone else, and hopefully someone who runs their company in a more respectful manner.

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Post by flyingfool » Wed Mar 25, 2009 14:08

This is ALL the reason why the Federal government should stay the H-E double hockey sticks out of owning private business!

This all would have been a non issue if they had let AIG go belly up!

There is a place for government regulation. And then there is Government OVER regulation.

The toxic cancer cell that has caused EVERYTHING was the result of Barney Frank Chris Dodd and the GOVERNMENT "community reinvestment act". It ALL started with Government INVOLVEMENT, not the lack of government involvement.

What bank would not issue a loan even when they believe that the person getting the loan would not pay it back when the GOVERNMENT in the form of Fannie/Freddie would simply buy the loan away from the bank? The bank has ZERO risk. They passed the risk on to Fannie/Freddie which is now you and I.

And when confronted several times, the GOVERNMENT oversight in the form of Mr. Barney Frank and Chris Dodd ignored the warnings that the risk was too high and that calamity would likely result. They almost literally threw the whistle blowers out of the House/Senate Chambers for even hinting at such a thing. Bush tried to regulate the risk and the DEMOCRAT controlled Congress told Bush to go blow it out his backside!

The other banks took these bad loans they didn't sell to Fannie and they grouped them together with some good loans and convinced other idiots that it was a good buy and sold them.

Now these are all called "toxic" paper. It ALL stems back 100% to the GOVERNMENT involvement in pushing the issuance of loans, and the LACK of GOVERNMENT action EVEN when WARNED that catastrophe was immenant. But then again, Dodd got VIP special low interest loans and Frank & Dodd both took huge amounts of campaign cash from AIG. As well as McCain and Obama himself. And I have not heard these two upstanding individuals or any other congressmen who received campaign cash from AIG say they will give that money back to AIG just as they are demanding the bonus back from the CEO's. Even though they also voted to allow the bonuses in the first place with Dodd even literally writing that specific language into the law! Hypocrites of the first order all of them!

Deregulation by Reagan created the single largest, fastest and longest lasting period of consistant growth since of the boom following WWII. So to blame this on deregulation is total BUNK!

The SEC was a government oversight regulation body and it did NOTHING to stop Madhoff even after "investigating" him 8 differnt times. Come to find out that Madhoff's I think kid just so happens to married to a person in the SEC....How convenient!

If AIG was allowed to go bankrupt, they insurance arm of the company would have been bought out immediately as it was actually making money for the company. It was the "investment" day traders who tied the anchor around the company's neck.

AIG also did not offer me a good quote for aircraft insurance so for me it is a non issue. I can save money by going elsewhere!

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Post by Jerry Eichenberger » Wed Mar 25, 2009 14:14

Flying Fool -

I respectfully dissent. First, deregulation of the airline industry ruined it. It took a glorious way to travel and reduced it to cattle cars where we now pay to check a bag, get no food domestically, and put up with the smelly masses and screaming kids on their way to visit Grandma, who ought to be riding the Greyhound.

As for letting AIG go belly up, you can't. There ARE businesses too big to fail, and the world wide result would have been catastrophic.

I'm a Repub., but one who tries to learn before acting.
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Post by MikeB » Wed Mar 25, 2009 17:53

Jerry I respectfully disagree.......... :?
Deregulation allowed the 'masses' to be able to fly at a reasonable price. My son , daughter-in-law and only grandchild live 1500 miles south of me. Whyshould they not have the priviledge for being able to fly rather than spending two days a car or on a bus to visit? And you can't get there from here by train, by the way. Without deregulation, the price of flying would only be for the 'elite'. When I started flying on commerial airlines they all had radial engines, although I agree with you regarding cattle car lines and no food. Of course, those than can afford it also have the priveledge of flying 'first class'.

Without deregulation, "Ma" Bell would be in charge of our telephones and probably our only source for cell phones. Also, I spent enough time in the trucking business to remember when regulated transportation would only allow trucks in franchiced areas and buses running up and down the road with no one in them (unless some noisy, smelly kid was on the way to see grandma).

Personally, I say, let them fail and file for bankrupcy like the little guy and 'throw the bums out of congress' that let it happen on their watch. Good God! When I built my house I had to put down a large down payment and prove I had the means to pay for it.

Mike Berg

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